Thinking out loud

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Lander123
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Thinking out loud

Post by Lander123 » Tue Jun 27, 2017 5:03 pm

Blew my 1.3 up a while ago in my modified samurai, she's been in the shed without an engine for a little bit now thinking of going diesel instead of petrol now and after being in a mate diahatsu fourtrak really keen to put the 2.8 in her just wondering if anybody has every tried it? Not afraid of fabricating ect. Cheers jack

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Re: Thinking out loud

Post by ROBBIE » Tue Jun 27, 2017 5:54 pm

Never done it, but will be heavy
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Re: Thinking out loud

Post by Jordi » Tue Jun 27, 2017 6:15 pm

Vitara 1.6 8v for ease. 16v for power but more wiring.
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Re: Thinking out loud

Post by ScottieJ » Tue Jun 27, 2017 8:45 pm

It won't be easy to fit, you'll need to fit the whole transmission and it will be heavy.

Sj's are great because of their lack of weight, personally I think heavy diesels ruin them.

Let's just say I've known a lot more people that have been unhappy after a diesel swap than people that have liked it.
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Re: Thinking out loud

Post by ScottieJ » Tue Jun 27, 2017 8:47 pm

Don't get me wrong the 2.8 is a great engine, just not for an sj in my opinion, I won't fit an engine that isn't aluminium.
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Anton
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Re: Thinking out loud

Post by Anton » Thu Jun 29, 2017 3:17 pm

I have a Ford Fusion 1.4 diesel, it's a super slow thing, gutless, but cheap and reliable. My brother recently bought a new fiesta 1.6 diesel, which is far more economical, powerful etc - so I did a bit of research and it turns out that the engine is basically the same, and it's aluminium. His is more efficient, with an intercooler and a better oilway design that increases efficiency, plus 200cc.

This engine is everywhere, in one form or another. PSA used them, Volvo used them, Ford used them. The intercooled 1.6 is gutsy, and if you pull it out of a Volvo, apparently you get the "choice" version with all the leaks and other problems of the PSA version sorted out.

Other options I considered in a past life:

Toyota 1ND-TV 1.4 intercooled TD. Brilliant engine. Get the 90hp/140lb-ft version with the variable geometry turbo, I used to have this in a Yaris and it's all kinds of brilliant. Just pulls like a train. All aluminium.

VW 1.2 TDI (ANY/ANZ) 3cyl. Apparently can be remapped to about the same power as the Toyota, but lighter, and more efficient. Was only sold in the German domestic market in the Lupo 3L and Audi A2 3L. Look up "tuneco" on Facebook or Google for more on that engine.
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Re: Thinking out loud

Post by donkeychomp » Thu Jun 29, 2017 8:04 pm

Diesel engines made from ally now?
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Re: Thinking out loud

Post by ScottieJ » Fri Jun 30, 2017 12:02 am

The main issue with those modern diesels is the electrics though......loads of them! Also actually mating one up to an sj box or other suitable rwd box could be a challenge, most engines from fwd cars aren't an easy fit, simple things like the starter and exhaust manifold positionsn etc. can cause some major figment issues. You'll probably also need a custom flywheel as nearly everything is dual mass now.

There's 3 things I look at with sj engine swaps, fuel economy doesn't bother me.

Weight (adding 100kg+ to the front of an sj isn't greet when they are already light in the back)

Simplicity of the swap (generally the more complicated the more expensive it is)

Power output compared to easier options (what's the point in fitting something that's loads of work for next to no power gains or the power in completely the wrong rev range for sj gearing over something that almost drops straight in?)
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Re: Thinking out loud

Post by Anton » Sat Jul 01, 2017 6:05 pm

donkeychomp wrote:Diesel engines made from ally now?
Yuh-huh. Ally degrades over time when subjected to vibrations, which is why diesels are generally made from cast iron (which isn't damaged by vibrations). At least, that's what I read once. Anyhew, modern manufacturing techniques means ally blocks can be built that withstand diesel vibrations (I think it's as much to do with advances in diesel engine refinement reducing vibrations actually) means ally diesel blocks have been a thing for a while now.
ScottieJ wrote:The main issue with those modern diesels is the electrics though......loads of them! Also actually mating one up to an sj box or other suitable rwd box could be a challenge, most engines from fwd cars aren't an easy fit, simple things like the starter and exhaust manifold positionsn etc. can cause some major figment issues. You'll probably also need a custom flywheel as nearly everything is dual mass now.

There's 3 things I look at with sj engine swaps, fuel economy doesn't bother me.

Weight (adding 100kg+ to the front of an sj isn't greet when they are already light in the back)

Simplicity of the swap (generally the more complicated the more expensive it is)

Power output compared to easier options (what's the point in fitting something that's loads of work for next to no power gains or the power in completely the wrong rev range for sj gearing over something that almost drops straight in?)
The weight thing and the power/gearing thing is what stopped me, before I even started to think about the complexity of a diesel swap. Personally, if I were to be spending the money on a relatively new engine for an SJ, it'd be a petrol ecoboost, because you can get off the shelf ECU and wiring harnesses direct from Ford for all but the 1.0 (and you can get those aftermarket). £2k. Ummm...

Yeah, 1.6 8v it is then. Speaking of which - Scottie - have you got some engine mounts for a 1.6? The 1.3 is dead and I have a 1.6 lying about...

Just so you know, my last post was just going with the theme of this post - thinking out loud. Not seriously considering anything like that!!!
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Re: Thinking out loud

Post by twiss » Sun Jul 02, 2017 4:21 am

Anton wrote:Yeah, 1.6 8v it is then. Speaking of which - Scottie - have you got some engine mounts for a 1.6? The 1.3 is dead and I have a 1.6 lying about...
Use the same engine mounts with a new hole drilled...
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