Extended spring perches?

[NylonAdmiral]

As it says at the bottom of the post in the link, I wanted to test it and see how it went. I thought about making the tether adjustable to be able to tune it but no longer need to. As it happens, I have since fitted shorter shackles and it's actually reduced the amount of permissible movement to a level that I think is better. I believe you need to have a small amount of movement but not too much.

Whilst I think that this has all now resulted in a reasonable SPOA/anti-wrap setup I won't be doing it on my next build. YJs are a better solution all together so that's what I'll be using on the tin top.

After living with it for a few years I wouldn't advocate SPOA again, but if I were to do it, then I would make another anti wrap bar and use exactly the same design again.

[ScottieJ]

Ah my bad, I didn't realise you ended up fitting a shorter shackle since you made the vid

[NylonAdmiral]

Well it's a sensible observation. If I hadn't fitted the shorter shackles, as you say, I would have implemented what you were suggesting.

It's fairly tricky to get everything bang on in the first iteration. I was lucky in that I was only one iteration out really which was negated by the change in shackles.

[d_r_1989]

You make it look rather easy to make it!

[timwilks13]

In the video the workshop time is sped up, actually took longer than it appears.

[NylonAdmiral]

Don't listen to Tim, he's just trolling you...

...it's actually slowed down.

[mike harris]

Yeh I snapped a full leaf spring, in half, half way down the spring, springs where 6 years old. You can't blame wrap on that, would have to wrap lol which it doesn't.

Anyway anti wrap bars are a great idea, all cars need them. Nissan and Toyota and every other manufacture that doesn't use them, should?....

Sorry lads !

[NylonAdmiral]

That's slightly disingenuous. It's kind of like saying 'Nissan and Toyota and every other manufacture that doesn't supply vehicles with 37 inch tyres, should?'. Its a great mod but the vehicle has to be modified in order to accomodate them. With SPOA on a zuk, the vehicle is being modified and used in a way which was never envisaged by the manufacturers. The springs which come on most zuks are too thin & short to be used for anything more strenuous than mild byways. If you convert to SPOA and use the truck for anything fun then the springs get hammered and you need to come up with a way of dealing with that. Many people have had success with anti-wrap bars, some fit other springs (such as YJs) others have other solutions but they're all looking to answer the same problem which is basically the limitations of the standard springs which are exaggerated by SPOA.

I'm not saying anyone does or doesn't need an anti-wrap bar. I'm just saying it works for me with my suspension geometry and intended use.

Serious question which I don't know the answer to. How many manufacturers such as Nissan, Toyota, Land Rover etc supply standard vehicles from the factory with SPOA?

[mike harris]

Hilux

Navara

Mazda b2500

Ford ranger

Rwd transits

Many millions of cars !

[ScottieJ]

Most vehicles that come from the factory that are spoa run springs designed to be ran SPOA, they also use wider, stronger springs with a high spring rate for load carrying.

Plus hilux's actually have a bar on the front axle to stop wrap during heavy breaking.

Nearly all 4x4s are only designed to run standard size tyres and the gear reduction in low is quite mild as they are only designed for light off roading. No modern pick up is designed to do what we do from the factory. All the vehicles that are designed for serious off roading now run coil springs and link suspension.

We are modifying them well beyond the parameters that the factory components are designed for, fitting bigger engines and tyres with lower gearing than they were ever designed to run, hence why we have to upgrade mounts, shafts and everything in between.

Thousands of people all around the world fit anti wrap bars, loads of people fit Panhard rods to improve the steering. Are they needed? Maybe not but do they make the vehicle preform better and more reliable? Well they must do if so many people choose to do it. I'm not saying it's always needed, it solely depends on your personal set up and if you think it would be a benifit to your vehicle or not. I'm just advising that from my experience I've known and offered advice to many people that felt the need to fit one and seen all kinds of vehicles that do suffer from axle wrap on all kinds of spring set ups.

Just putting down a blanket statement that they aren't needed at all comes across as a bit ignorant tbh just type in anti wrap bar, any tramp bar, bam bar etc in Google or YouTube and loads of results come up for every marque of vehicle. Yes it does depend on your set up but most agree that if you want to run soft springs for maximum articulation it's a good idea.

I bet you have more wrap than you think mike, yeah it might not be enough to worry about but there will be some, all leaf springs have a bit, even brand new ones. stick a go pro under your truck and give it some throttle in low box and I bet the diff nose lifts a bit, yeah it might not be enough to worry about but there will be some. If you don't have any at all I'll happily eat some humble pie

You are actually supposed to set up your pinion angle 1-2* lower than the angle of the tbox so that when under constant load the UJs are perfectly in phase.